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Episode 13 - The Truth About Monogamy & polyamory
Hosted by Mel & Suzie

Melany Krangle & Suzie Sheckter

Speaker A: Welcome to sharing my truth with Melan. Suzie the uncensored version where we bear it all.

Speaker B: We do 1234.

Speaker A: Um, hello, everyone. Welcome back. Welcome back to sharing my truth. Hey, babe.

Speaker B: Hello, darling. Hi.

Speaker A: How are you?

Speaker B: I'm good.

Speaker A: And I'm Susie. And that's mel.

Speaker B: This is Mel.

Speaker A: Say Mel.

Speaker B: Mel. Mel.

Speaker A: Like Scary Spice.

Speaker B: Oh, yeah. 25 years of the Spice.

Speaker A: Hot Mel.

Speaker B: ****.

Speaker A: They just all look better, you know what I mean? They just have not aged. They've aged so well.

Speaker B: Some of them look better than others. Really?

Speaker A: Yeah, I think Ginger spice looks amazing.

Speaker B: ******* so good. She looks way better. But she's got a really rich husband.

Speaker A: Maybe that oh, ******* good for her. I mean, she's a ******* Spice Girl, though.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: She could have anyone she wants.

Speaker B: That's true. But no, she looks super good. Really elegant. Really? She looks great. Sexy.

Speaker A: Sexy.

Speaker B: She just turned 50.

Speaker A: That's amazing. I mean, you're kind of like a.

Speaker B: Spice Girl, but someday I'm on.

Speaker A: That's a scary spice, Mel. I don't know. You don't wear much cheetah print, though.

Speaker B: I don't?

Speaker A: Not as much as I'd like. I'm a big cheetah print girl.

Speaker B: It's not really my bag. Yeah, okay. I've got pink.

Speaker A: Yeah, you're pink girl.

Speaker B: I got pink on my glasses.

Speaker A: You're a very pink girl.

Speaker B: I love a bit of pink, but no cheetah.

Speaker A: Well, I mean, the Spice Girls are kind of what we're talking today. If I was just to get in.

Speaker B: On them, as in it's spicy or there are lots of them. Both. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Why not?

Speaker A: Because I think it's like if I could get into the Spice Girls and have, like, a big orgy with the Spice Girls like that's that's we're talking about today really?

Speaker B: That that would be your thing?

Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. I think you do use I think Ginger with Spice would be the best one, to be honest.

Speaker B: Yeah. Oh, yeah, that's right. They all kind of had relationships with each other as well, didn't they? Didn't you know that?

Speaker A: What is this British gossip that I've never heard?

Speaker B: Yeah. No. Well, I think scary Mel mel b. Right?

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Slept with Ginger Spice and then she outed her on British television. ****. And Spice got well annoyed with her.

Speaker A: No.

Speaker B: And then I think one of the others but I think there was the wish shenanigans. Oh, I'm ******* obsessed with that.

Speaker A: But I don't like the outing thing. That's ****** up.

Speaker B: No. And it's not cool. I mean, if that's really not cool, private and everything, I'm happy they got it on.

Speaker A: I bet Ginger Spice was just, like, really good.

Speaker B: I have no comment. Really? I don't know. I was not a big Spice Girls fan, to be honest with you.

Speaker A: Maybe they were just maybe just a little past your prime in that time. No, but I mean, like, you were in years.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: So you were in your 20s or 30s when they were big.

Speaker B: I'm the same age as the Spice Girls. So they were in their 20s. Right, I was in my 20s. Right.

Speaker A: But maybe, like, Spice Girls were for younger girls. No, like, they were for, like, 13 year olds.

Speaker B: It was a bit weird.

Speaker A: A bit boppy. Like pop boppy.

Speaker B: It was. And then later on, everyone kind of got on the Spice Girls bandwagon. Now, I feel, because it was such a massive Brit pop girl band, and I don't think there's been one since.

Speaker A: No, they were and they were the powerhouse.

Speaker B: Yeah, exactly.

Speaker A: Anyways, we're getting on about the Spice Girl a lot. Honestly, it's all relative, because this is what we're talking about. We're talking about polyamory and monogamy.

Speaker B: Yeah. I love the way you've got it round. Polyamory and monogamy. Not monogamy and polyamory, because polyamory is.

Speaker A: The ******* future, baby.

Speaker B: That's your mindset. Absolutely.

Speaker A: The way I think about it.

Speaker B: It'S.

Speaker A: So much more future forward and future thinking to have multiple people you love and not even just love, but share your body with. And, like, the only other species that.

Speaker B: Does this is swans and lobsters.

Speaker A: And lobsters monogamy.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: I just feel it feels a bit old fashioned for the future of sexual fluidity.

Speaker B: Well, if you put it like that, then yes, it is. It is, isn't it? I mean, what's my view? Well, my view is probably different to your view. However, I would say everyone has to do what's right for them, what makes them happy, of course. And what makes me happy is not what makes the next person happy. My only real comment would be, it could get very complicated.

Speaker A: 100%.

Speaker B: And I mean very comp, especially if you're families and you have children involved and stuff like that. It gets super complicated. And then what happens if that I mean, I don't know. I don't know the answer to this question. If the love is not evenly distributed between all the members of a polyamorous group. So let's say you kind of all start from one point. But I've seen this before. Not necessarily. I mean, personally don't know any polyamorous couples, or many might know one is that I've seen it in sort of popular culture type of things, where you start off in a thruffle, I guess, and then the bond or the love or whatever grows stronger between two and the three.

Speaker A: I mean, that's where jealousy comes in. Right?

Speaker B: Yeah, but that's a natural human state.

Speaker A: I know, but I think you can combat jealousy in the same way you can combat any other emotion. You know what I mean? If you know that, you're a very jealous person and this most likely polyamory is not for you, but let's say.

Speaker B: You wanted to try it, but you.

Speaker A: Know you're a jealous person, you can always work on that emotion and try to feel happy for your partner who's also feeling pleasure with someone else.

Speaker B: Sure. Look, I'm not saying it can't work. If you look at it logically, maybe it does work because it also means that everyone kind of is happy in the sense that sometimes you want to do your own thing in a relationship and you don't want to always please the other person. And I don't mean just sexually. If there's more people, then it kind of gives more room for everyone to kind of do their own thing. So I do understand that. I do obviously understand, obviously understand the sexual element because there are so many people saying today, and it's not just started today, it started, you know, years ago, that monogamy is not a natural human state because human beings want to have multiple partners or have sexual desires or whatever for other for multiple partners. So can monogamy actually work? The fact is society is actually set up, albeit very old fashioned for monogamy. So things would have to change in.

Speaker A: Many ways because we live in a Christian world. In a Christian new world.

Speaker B: Yeah. Judeo christian world. Absolutely. But I mean, I guess the answer is it really depends on the couple. It depends on you. Depends on, like you said, your levels of jealousy or whether you could also whether you have the capacity or the desire or the need to love more than one person. It kind of depends on a lot of different things because it's not just sexual, is it? Because it may start that way, but then obviously it's going to become love and if you extend that into a family.

Speaker A: Polyamory, I think, is just as old as monogamy. It's just obviously our society we now live in. But I think monogamy has just been used as a way not that this is the only way, but it's been used as a way to kind of suppress us and put us into boxes that maybe we just do not fit in and whether obviously if you want to be monogamous, that's amazing, that's beautiful. You want to have one partner and share your life with them, of course, and not saying any part of it is wrong, but there's other ways that people can live that's if they want to be what we can call ethically non monogamous. And of making sure you're telling your partner, making sure that everyone involved is completely consensual and like, understanding of like, this is what we want to do and this is what's going to make us the most happy, all of us the most happy and not just one person. Like what we usually see in polygamist families where it's like maybe this isn't probably the right thing for everyone involved, but yeah, I mean, there's obviously just a whole schmorgisborg of different people who want to live so much differently. And whether that's legal or not or ethical or not, I think it just depends on the person.

Speaker B: Yeah, no, I mean, I completely agree with everything you just said. I think that everyone has to be completely on board, everyone has to be wanting this. So what is often the problem? I think from my point of view and that goes down to even like relationships, like just where it's sexual, just like a threesome is often one or two people want it. Three people do not equally want it in the same way or people go along often in relationships with something that somebody else wants because they want them to be happy, then you are, in, as far as I'm concerned, dangerous territory because ultimately you won't be happy. If you are in a relationship, whether it's an open relationship or whether it's polyamorous and all the people involved know and that's what everyone wants, everyone's happy, then that's great. Then there's no reason why that shouldn't work. And I do think it's completely wrong for people to judge it and we still are not in a space where we live in a society where people are not judging that. We're nowhere near that. But I think it's difficult and I don't think there are that many people and talking of all the people in the relationship who would all be happy and I think that can be the problem. Yeah.

Speaker A: I mean, just like you're saying people aren't open with themselves because to come out to your family as being like, I am in a polyamorous relationship, that is a lot to take in as a family. Or like friends and being like because a lot of people not that being a polyamorous is, like, morally incorrect, but for a lot of people, they don't understand why that some people a lot of people go towards you're wrong. There's probably something else going on. Someone else is going to be jealous. I don't believe that you can do this, you guys are going to break up and people are just not supportive. So a lot of people are in the closet. Like I don't know of any polyamorous relationships in my groups that I've ever been a part of in my adult life and I'm sure I've known some. But whether people come out themselves towards it, it's just I mean, if you're a polyamorous and you're a friend of mine, please let me know. Yeah, I want to talk about it.

Speaker B: Absolutely.

Speaker A: Let's chat about it.

Speaker B: Absolutely. Look, I mean, at the end of the day life I always say that life is short but life is long kind of thing. So it's short in the sense that you have to do what you want to do and you have to live it in the way that makes you happy. But it's long in the sense if you're unhappy, it's a ****** long time, right? So you have to do the things that you want to do in life, whether that is be monogamous and have children and have a more traditional life and if you feel that's what's going to make you happy or if that is the opposite. Then you have to do that because life it's depressing if you don't live the way you want to live. Right. I just think the reality of actually finding people who are all on board all want to do the same thing. It's a sustainable thing. Or maybe that doesn't matter. Maybe you just do it and if it works, it works. If it doesn't, it doesn't. But I'm sure there can be or there are people who get involved in a relationship and then it doesn't work, and then you're blowing up all these lives. The only thing I can sort of compare it to is I've known people who've been into swinging. Oh, yeah? They wanted to do it because they wanted to obviously have more sexual partners, and then they go to I guess generally it's sort of swinging parties.

Speaker A: Their friends.

Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, in old days used to call it key parties. So they go to the parties and then the intention is it that it's complete, it's just sexual. But I've known two couples where they've met and they've met a partner and they've gone off and they've left their original partner, which is not the point of swinging. The swinging point is just to have the experience and then go back and be happy with your partner. But they've actually completely left the original partner.

Speaker A: That probably would have happened anyway.

Speaker B: Sure. And I agree with that. If you're that going to be led astray, it probably would have happened anyway.

Speaker A: Oh, my God. That's difficult. It's just getting to that right balance. Right. And finding the right people, finding your community about it. There is a huge polyamorous community that we just are just they're underground or not underground, but we just don't know about them. Obviously, if you're going to sex clubs or any of these things that are more fetish friendly, you're obviously going to find more of your people. Go to Facebook group. Sure. There probably is. There's more ways to find people like you than you think.

Speaker B: Yeah, and that's true. It must be difficult to, like, do people what's the point, actually, if they're in a polyamorous relationship, how does that happen?

Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, you just find the right people.

Speaker B: Does it evolve that way? Do they start? Do two people start and then they bring like this whole idea of the unicorn. Right, right. You bring in your unicorn partner.

Speaker A: Yeah, I've been a unicorn before.

Speaker B: You've been a unicorn? Absolutely.

Speaker A: Not for like a partner, but just for like a threesome.

Speaker B: So like one off.

Speaker A: One off.

Speaker B: Yeah. So I'm not sure if a unicorn because I saw this in a documentary okay. Where this woman was a unicorn. So these people were having a people this a man and a woman having a relationship, and they had this unicorn partner, which I find fascinating and fantastic that she's called a unicorn.

Speaker A: Yeah, I love that. I don't know that's what they were called.

Speaker B: Yeah. Comes in to the relationship for well, I mean, I think initially it's sexual, but then it's not necessarily sexual, and they sort of have a polyamorous thing. So I'm not sure if there's crossover there because that unicorn person isn't necessarily having a full time relationship with the other two people. But the point is that she's a unicorn because she's what they both want, and she's like, I guess, spreading magical dust on their relationship and making them happy. I guess that's why she's called unicorn. But then does that then develop into a polyamorous relationship? I have no idea.

Speaker A: Well, no, I think it can, but I think if the woman or man who would be the unicorn or whoever would be the unicorn, I think it would just be like they could come and go as they please. Maybe that person is just a very non monogamous person. They kind of want to sleep with.

Speaker B: A bunch of people, and they don't.

Speaker A: Want a relationship at all.

Speaker B: So that's the thing. I understand that. I think that that could work. Like, if you think about it, you know when you've ever been on holiday with friends? Holiday, vacation, vacation, holiday in British North Americans, when you've gone on vacation with friends and they can often drive you nuts because you want to do your thing, and then they have their whole thing planned out, especially, have you ever been on vacation with friends where I'm pretty chilled? I don't really my whole life I'm the same way, structured and scheduled, and I have to do a lot of stuff like you in the day. When I go on vacation, I don't want a schedule. I do not want to be going to the museum at 09:00 a.m. And meeting somebody for a run at 06:00 a.m. Or whatever it is. Forget it. It's not happening. And I've been on vacation with friends who are like that, and it's just a complete and I love them to death, but it's a total nightmare, and I don't give a **** about the next bridge in wherever or the next museum or I'm just going to go and have a beer.

Speaker A: Yes, you go to it.

Speaker B: So then I think of polyamorous relationships, of like, oh, my God, there's all these people. Because the more people in a thing like and I'm talking friendship, that's what I'm talking about going on vacation, the more complicated life is, because you got to please all these people.

Speaker A: Yeah, you're not wrong. Because I feel like even one relationship is a lot.

Speaker B: Exactly. So I get, obviously, the sexual element, wanting to bring some excitement or whatever it is. But the relationship oh, my God, another person. Another person to keep happy, another person to kind of deal with their foibles, like the way they put they put their towel on the floor or their toothbrush not back in that whatever it is. You know what I mean, that I don't get. Why do you want another?

Speaker A: Well, it's funny.

Speaker B: What does it diminish think of polyamorous relationship?

Speaker A: I think honestly, consent is so important in polyamorous relationships and so I think communication might even be better in polyamorous relationships than monogamous relationships.

Speaker B: That's a good point.

Speaker A: Because, ****, if one person if you're with one person and you've had a long day and they're ******* you off, you know what I mean?

Speaker B: It's just like that's a good point.

Speaker A: To talk to this one person. And maybe it's just a whole thing, but if you're like an actual kind of a community as long as you're not talking behind each other's backs. Yeah, because that's crazy and toxic.

Speaker B: I wonder if that does that.

Speaker A: Well, I'm sure it does, but that's other toxic relationships. But it might be that the communication is actually just better because you can have not like family meetings, but kind of diffuse it. But kind of diffuse it in a better way. Being like interesting point, understanding everyone's yeses and no's already from the get go.

Speaker B: That's an interesting yeah, I never thought of it like that. I mean, the average polyamorous couple, how many people are in it? Three or four?

Speaker A: I think you do have as many as you want. I watched a thing that was like six.

Speaker B: God, that's just it's.

Speaker A: So many.

Speaker B: But do six people all sleep in the same bed at night?

Speaker A: I think they like to.

Speaker B: Can you actually find a bed for six people?

Speaker A: I was telling you, I was watching this thing and this woman came into their house. It was on Netflix and she made a bed so that they could all cuddle in.

Speaker B: But how many of them were there? Six.

Speaker A: Oh my God.

Speaker B: Yes. And six of what? Sex, gender?

Speaker A: All of them? Like boy girl, boy, girl, boy, girl, or something like that.

Speaker B: Wow. Yeah. So three boys, three girls.

Speaker A: Yeah, I think so.

Speaker B: Oh my God. Oh my God. Well, where's the level?

Speaker A: And they just all have different fetishes. It was so interesting.

Speaker B: Wow.

Speaker A: I forget the name of the show. It's this woman who builds sex rooms for couples. And it's actually amazing and hilarious. A lot of it's like a lot to take.

Speaker B: Right.

Speaker A: But the episode about polyamorous is polyamorous family. And I believe it was like this couple that start like they were just like a couple and then they found someone, and then they found someone else, and then they found someone else, and then they found someone else and it just turned into this now poly family. And they all live together and they have this nice little sex room. They go in and they do everything. It's amazing.

Speaker B: Sort of switch around.

Speaker A: They all switch around however they want. God, if one person's not feeling it, the other one can. No pressure or days in the week. A lot of orgasms to have in one day.

Speaker B: Imagine.

Speaker A: How do you work? How do you get any work done?

Speaker B: I don't know. That's complicated.

Speaker A: It's a bit complicated, but I don't know. I don't think that's for me. I don't even think I could be a polyamorous person. As in being in a relationship with more than one person.

Speaker B: That's what I'm saying. That like hardcore.

Speaker A: Being a non monogamous person and just having that open relationship, an open conversation. It's totally different to be in an actual relationship with other people at the same time because there's just so much because love is such a huge, powerful emotion.

Speaker B: It's all consuming and all consuming. Six people.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: I'm not sure I could handle it. I mean, like I've always said, I've been married 25 years. In my family in particular, everyone's been married at an average of four times. I just give up. I mean, it's just like what's the point?

Speaker A: Yeah, it's a lot.

Speaker B: It's a lot. And to like I don't know, I don't think I could handle that.

Speaker A: Yeah, definitely. It's not for everyone. And that's obviously why monogamy has gone so far as it has. We haven't gone into polyamory, but I think because Gen Z is getting much more sexually fluid and all of these new genders which are amazing, are coming out. People are wanting so many different things and it's been incredible to watch it happen in real time. And I'm not saying that polyamory is going to be like out the monogamy people. I doubt that's ever going to happen. But to have more and people that.

Speaker B: Are out to have options. But I think that's the thing is you basically do what you want to do. So the people who want to be monogamous, your monogamous, the people who want to be polyamorous, your polyamorous, the people who want to be open, be open, blah blah blah. But as long as whoever you're in the relationship with is happy with that and is all on board with that, then that's completely fine. But we are not there as a society. And I don't just mean Gen Xers or Boomers or older, even older than that, thinking oh my God, that blows their mind kind of thing. I think a lot of people, even millennials and totally younger, that would blow their mind and they wouldn't want it. If they did want it, there wouldn't be so many people with so many problems of people cheating.

Speaker A: Well, here's the thing also where it's like and we've talked about this before, but it's like you have to love yourself 1st 100%, obviously to actually be okay with loving someone else first and then maybe loving someone other than that.

Speaker B: I always say that if you're in a relationship, you have to be happy. A relationship will make you happier, probably will add to your happiness if you like. It is not going to make you happy. If you are seeking a relationship to make you happy, that's a bad news. As far as I'm concerned, you have to find some happiness in yourself, in your life, in your work, in your family and whatever it is. But you have to be happy yourself and then you have a relationship with somebody and together, or more than together because if your polyamorous is more than one then you're happier. It's not the answer to happiness. And I think most people or a huge percentage of people who are in monogamous relationships, they meet somebody quite young or youngish, say in your you are looking, you are seeking happiness and you think that happiness is going to come in the form of a person, not in yourself. And I think that's the root of a lot of people's problems and I've seen it time and time and time again. People are looking for happiness in another person which is a huge amount of pressure to put on another person rather than being happy themselves. And then they don't want the same things in life, they're not going for the same goals, they're not interested in the same things and they sort of keep going as long as they can and then it just kind of doesn't work anymore for a variety of different reasons.

Speaker A: I mean you have to have your own sense of your self worth 100% to bring any other kind of emotion in because you're always going to feed off of someone else's thoughts of you and things like this. If you don't have those positive thoughts towards yourself, you have to.

Speaker B: Because if you think about a relationship, whether you've been together a couple of years or you're younger so you're 18 and you've been with somebody for a year, or you're my age and we married for 25 years, if you are, that reliant on another person. Somebody can turn around, whoever it is and go, that's it, I've had enough. Then what do you do? If you're just like a shell of a person and it's just that other person that makes you whole, then you're in trouble, aren't you? And that happens often because people seek happiness or a they look for a partner that they think is going to make them happy full stop. And they look for that partner. They think they're going to find this partner and if they don't want or they're not exactly the way they want them, they're going to be able to change them and make them exactly what they want. Well, people don't change that much. They kind of evolve a bit but they don't actually change. Those are my thoughts. I love that.

Speaker A: So Mel, what do we think about the fact that possibly scientific studies have been done to say that non monogamous couples or people are happier than monogamous ones?

Speaker B: Yeah, I mean I think there's quite a lot of studies and if I look at my facts it's Mel's fact check time. So this is an article by YouGov America.

Speaker A: Okay? You Gov America.

Speaker B: YouGov not YouGov, America, and I will link all of this in the blog.

Speaker A: Okay, great.

Speaker B: So it's all going to be there. So you'll see all the facts that one third of Americans say their ideal relationship is non monogamous. I mean, that's huge percentage of people. Yeah.

Speaker A: And that might obviously not be like polyamorous, but just non monogamous, as in like an open relationship of some sort.

Speaker B: Yeah. That they can't see that that's going to work for them. Exactly. For whatever reason. This article is actually from 2020, but it said that a January poll they did of more than 1300 US. Adults found that one third of US. Adults said that their ideal relationship is non monogamous to some degree. That's complicated. What does that mean exactly? I don't know.

Speaker A: Yeah, like, are they ethical sleds or non ethical *****?

Speaker B: Well, yeah, I mean, that's the problem. So 43% of millennials are particularly likely to say their ideal relationship is non monogamous.

Speaker A: Millennials?

Speaker B: Millennials, yeah. Though an equal percentage, 43% of millennials say that their ideal relationship is completely monogamous. So I think it's sort of fairly split. But I think what they have said in this article, they said that they did a poll in 2016, and it was 62,016 to this article was four years earlier that 61% said they wanted to be completely monogamous. So the point is it had shifted in that time, and that's probably a lot to do with Gen Z's. Yeah.

Speaker A: Even, like, growing up two years now. Yeah.

Speaker B: Gen z growing.

Speaker A: 2023.

Speaker B: **** it's.

Speaker A: 2023.

Speaker B: Jesus Christ. I know. Today, three years.

Speaker A: Holy ****.

Speaker B: Sort of around this time since the beginning of the pandemic. Can you believe that?

Speaker A: Oh, my God, I would cry.

Speaker B: Okay.

Speaker A: Anyway. Jesus Christ.

Speaker B: Excuse me. Among US. Adults who are in relationship 23% say their current relationship is non monogamous to some degree. So that's people who know yeah, that is non.

Speaker A: That's a lot.

Speaker B: 23%.

Speaker A: 23% is not a lot.

Speaker B: That seems like that 23% of people are happy with that.

Speaker A: Yeah, people are ******* getting on a good time.

Speaker B: I think that's the thing too.

Speaker A: That's not just millennials. That's like everyone.

Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. About three in ten millennials in a relationship say their relationship is non monogamous. Of this group, 8% define their relationship as completely non monogamous. I mean, there could be an element that millennials depends what age group, what age you're talking about millennials. And they're young, so they're not actually wanting to be they're not ready for monogamous. Monogamous. Monogamous relationship. I mean, that could be part of it.

Speaker A: Yeah, most likely. That is a part of it. I hope that's a part of it. I want people to have sexual experiences before they settle down. The only way to do this, if you have less than one or less than three partners I don't know.

Speaker B: I think the thing is not enough. No, but also, you don't know when you're going to meet somebody. So you could be 1516 2023, 25. What do you do if you've met the love of your life and you're 20 or 18 and you have no experience? What did you just say? Oh, sorry. Hang on a minute. I'll just come back to you in five years.

Speaker A: It's just gross.

Speaker B: The fact that it doesn't work.

Speaker A: I mean, we've talked about this as well, where it's like people are still talking about body count and how many people have you slept with?

Speaker B: Like, shut the **** up.

Speaker A: Like it matters. You want people to be experienced and know their body. That's my full stop today. That's it.

Speaker B: It doesn't make sense to me that.

Speaker A: Anyone would want to have sex with less people than that. It's so confusing. Don't you want people to be free and sexual and be good in bed, in quotes with you?

Speaker B: But that's the irony, isn't it? Yes. That often, and particularly men want women who know what they're doing but haven't had any sexual partners. And you're like, It doesn't work that way.

Speaker A: Sorry.

Speaker B: It doesn't work out that way at all. But I don't know. It's difficult. I don't understand why people care. Because why do they care?

Speaker A: I don't know.

Speaker B: They care. I don't know. Is it jealousy? Is it that if somebody you have a partner and you find out that partner has had a lot more that's sort of, I think, traditionally the viewpoint, let's say, and it was particularly men on women. Yeah. If they had less partners than the woman, then it would bug them because it made them I think it's probably the same.

Speaker A: It's like the same thing where it's like if your girl has a better job than you, let's say, makes more money than you, right. Then the man gets all scared. Not is, but can get spooked because they're like, oh my God, now I'm not a man anymore. It's like, oh my ******* God, are we still doing this?

Speaker B: Exactly. And I think there's also a huge level of hypocrisy because I think in Gen Z's today, particularly Gen Z's, they have a lot of sexual partners very young. So they have by the time they're sort of 18, they've already had six, seven, maybe more sexual partners, which I'm realistic about. A lot of parents of my age would be absolutely horrified if they knew that or felt like they'd think it I think perhaps, let's say older millennials or Gen X's. I don't think that was the case. Yes, you'd had sexual partners by the time you're 18, varying degrees, but you probably hadn't had as many. I think you'd probably had less. Yeah, but that's just the times. I think it is.

Speaker A: And lack of birth control and whatever else.

Speaker B: I don't know. In my generation, there was no lack.

Speaker A: Of birth control, but, like, just the conversation.

Speaker B: I could go and get it. I got it when I was I could get 1670.

Speaker A: Like, the knowledge of it, you know what I mean? No.

Speaker B: Especially I didn't grow up my whole childhood in England, but I spent sort of a certain part of my teens there and in the UK in England, the condoms were free. You could go and get them from a family planning clinic. They're free. Still do. That contraception is completely free in England. You didn't pay for the pill.

Speaker A: God, that'd be amazing.

Speaker B: I think now there's like a standard fee, but it's not like, here the cost. And here in Ontario it's only subsidized until you're 25. I don't know what the government thinks happens after you're 25.

Speaker A: You want to have babies or something. Yeah.

Speaker B: It's really not ******* out. Anyway, that's another discussion for another time. But I don't know, I'm not sure, is it? And it's not that it's easier to meet people, I don't know what it is. Why? Maybe it's just this idea of more fluidity, less barriers, less fear, I don't know. But that is another thing, and we've talked about this before, and I'm going to mention this again because it does concern me as a mother, Susie, okay. Is that there's nothing wrong with sexual fluidity. Having problems with my wife today. As long as you are careful.

Speaker A: Yes, I know.

Speaker B: We talk about this. We love it. It's a serious thing.

Speaker A: Let's be safe.

Speaker B: I mean, not only do you not want an unexpected pregnancy that is not fun, but you do not want the myriad of things that you can get that you cannot get rid of.

Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, it's just obvious. Multiple partners. More like increased your chances of getting an STI, of course. So let's be safe, please. Mel, I've told you, this idea of us, we're going to get condoms with our faces on them and they can think of us when they wrap their willie.

Speaker B: They really want to be thinking about me. Wrap our willie.

Speaker A: Okay, we're going to do it. I'm down, I'm ready.

Speaker B: You're ready? And I also want to encourage it's so important for particularly young women and young men to go and get tested. Yes. They don't do it. I talk about it all the time. I think it's important. Why do you have a hang up about that? Why do you care, like your kids, how many partners they've had or whatever, but it's really, really important to go and get tested. Everyone, let's be a realist, has had unprotected sex at some point in their life, because sex is not a logical thing and you don't most of the time go, oh, just hang on a minute, it's in the moment. Exactly. Yeah.

Speaker A: Things happen.

Speaker B: And that therein if lie the problem, Susie, but if the more partners you have, you have to be careful. You really do. Yeah. So what do we take? Let's get tested. Yeah.

Speaker A: Wear a condom.

Speaker B: Absolutely.

Speaker A: Have some little birth control, your choice, dealer's choice, birth control.

Speaker B: But remember, birth control is only for pregnancy people, of course. I know. I've had conversations with young people. That sounds very patronizing. Sorry. That people younger than me?

Speaker A: Yes, people need to wear condoms, and.

Speaker B: I'm not sure they know that.

Speaker A: I know.

Speaker B: It doesn't protect you from anything other than they don't understand. Yeah, I know. You need to wrap it up kind of thing. You got to wrap up your willie. Yeah.

Speaker A: Tell them and tell them. Say it.

Speaker B: Wrap up your willie.

Speaker A: Thank you, Mama Mel.

Speaker B: And also oral sex.

Speaker A: Yeah, I know, that's a tough one.

Speaker B: It's a very tough one.

Speaker A: Let's just be honest about it before.

Speaker B: It'S like doing it in a crisp packet. Remember, I explained that to you. That's what they say in England, a chip.

Speaker A: Really funny.

Speaker B: Well, it's just like crunchy.

Speaker A: Unless you're going to get flavored condoms, which, honestly, I have not seen in a while. Do you know what I mean? I mean, I'm sure you're not wearing.

Speaker B: Condoms, like, let's be honest.

Speaker A: But I have not seen flavored condoms in a very long time. And not that I'm looking either very much, because Jeff buys them, but it's interesting because I'm not to suck **** and to taste lube the entire time as a person who likes sucking ****. That's a lot. Okay. It's not good for anyone besides the STD.

Speaker B: Not the whole point of oral sex, is it? And we are now going very far.

Speaker A: Off sorry, we're very off topic. We're going to get right back on it.

Speaker B: But no, but actually it's not that far off. If you think about it.

Speaker A: It's multiple partners.

Speaker B: It's all about.

Speaker A: Getting jiggy with it.

Speaker B: Wrap your willie.

Speaker A: Get jiggy.

Speaker B: Yes. Wrap your willie, please. Thank you. Mel. Please. Saying that, please do that and moving on.

Speaker A: Well, do you have any more facts for us, Mel, or was that well, I probably have some more because I distracted you.

Speaker B: You did.

Speaker A: I sent you on a rampage on good STI check.

Speaker B: No, I mean, that was oh, actually, no, I do have another fact. So when asked about how they would feel if a partner came to them wanting to engage in sexual activity with someone else, most Americans, 67% of them, 67 say they wouldn't be okay with this. Yeah. So they wouldn't be okay with their partner having sex with somebody else. 67%.

Speaker A: 67%.

Speaker B: That's a lot.

Speaker A: Yeah, because I think most people are not okay with that.

Speaker B: Right. So just 6% say they would be okay with this, while 17% say their comfort with this would depend on the details of the situation. Yeah. So I think fundamentally.

Speaker A: Do we have it?

Speaker B: I'm having an AHA moment. Okay. This is my AHA moment. Okay. This could help the human race. I think that human beings like the idea of lots of partners because well, because it's more exciting and blah, blah, blah. I mean, don't need a rocket scientist for me to explain that. But in actuality, when it comes down to it, they're not so keen on the idea.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: Is that a light bulb moment?

Speaker A: So it's a fantasy almost.

Speaker B: I think a lot of people yeah, it's a fantasy, but in actual reality, what they're like, I don't desire is they want a relationship with one person who supports them, who loves them, and at the end of the day, in a kind of slightly narcissistic way, only wants them because it makes you feel better. Right. I mean, particularly, I think, women, if you think your man is always looking over your shoulder at the next woman coming down the street, doesn't make you feel fabulous.

Speaker A: Well, here's the thing. There's actually a term for that, but the opposite. It's called compersion. Compersion, if I'm saying it right, it's the opposite of jealousy. It's actually like, let's say you're a woman and your man is looking at another woman or cuddling with another woman or talking to another woman, and you actually find it kind of cute and sexy instead of being jealous about it.

Speaker B: So it's like the non sexual version of cuckolding.

Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. So funny.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Speaker A: So people aren't literally not jealous, just that's it. And I'm kind of like that. If I go to a bar with Jeff, I actually kind of like when women talk to him, because I'm like, yeah, it's nice other people want him.

Speaker B: Yeah. But I think that's a security level. I don't have any issue. That's true. It's funny. If women say something to me, I think it's hilarious. Yeah. I don't go nuts. I mean, that would be ridiculous. I couldn't care. Go nuts. To me, I don't think I'm jealous in that way. If Max and I are in a situation and somebody's flirted with you or whatever, we tell each other and we have a laugh about it because it's funny, because we're not jealous, because we don't have any desire, inkling or thought that that means anything at all. I mean, the difference for me is it's normally 80 year old men to hit on you. Yeah.

Speaker A: Or to hit on Max.

Speaker B: That's a good thing. Well, no, to hit on me. Whereas it's a bit different for men. Yeah. He's a fit, almost 50 year old man. It's a bit different. And he probably gets a variety a variety spectrum of ladies. Yes, exactly. But that doesn't bother me at all. I mean, that's the thing.

Speaker A: If your man, you know he's going to do it, it's kind of hot, and you're like, she's going to look at her or he's going to talk to her.

Speaker B: I see.

Speaker A: And then it's like you kind of make it a game or something. I don't think that but that's like.

Speaker B: A lot of people have their own thing. I don't think anything like that. I just think it's funny. I think it's funny.

Speaker A: Yeah, it's funny because it would never happen. You're like, Ha, *****, he is mine. Is that what it is.

Speaker B: Maybe that's good. Yeah. So recently we're walking down the street and Max and I like to go on our little walks. We're like little old people or go for a walk. And we went for a walk and literally I'm walking and these two women, and they were older, they weren't they were older than me and I was within earshot and they went, oh, his hat. And I thought it was hilarious.

Speaker A: I love that.

Speaker B: I was just a bit like, that's amazing. Yeah. And then it happened again another day when we were going past the well known synagogue here in Toronto Solaris, and he and this gaggle of women, and he walked past and obviously they thought, oh, Jewish boy. Exactly. Oh, he's like that. And I'm just like I am here. Oh, my God. But they did it within, like, earshot. I mean, I thought it was very, very funny.

Speaker A: That is so funny, but weird at the same time.

Speaker B: But I don't get upset about it.

Speaker A: No, of course not.

Speaker B: But I thought it was very funny. God, that's funny. Well, but I don't know what that term the term for that.

Speaker A: I don't know what that is. I think that's just you and your partner having fun.

Speaker B: Well, I just get funny not having any hang ups, not worrying about not being jealous or not worrying that the minute your partner is out of your.

Speaker A: Sight, they're going to do something happen.

Speaker B: And if you're in that situation, then it's bad, it's not good, it's not a happy road. Yeah. So get off that road.

Speaker A: It's hard, man. Jealousy is a really toxic thing. And so obviously polyamory is not for you if you get jealous.

Speaker B: No. Which a lot of people do.

Speaker A: But a lot of people in monogamous relationships are jealous.

Speaker B: Oh, my God. Yeah.

Speaker A: It's a personal problem.

Speaker B: I would ask, why are you jealous? Where does it come from? Because the people I know where that has happened. Something's happened. Like, I know people like where the wife endlessly calls the husband and stuff like that. And you're like but then you find out something's happened or where either endlessly calling, endlessly checking up, or that they go out for the evening and they endlessly call them or check up, or they go on, like a boys weekend or whatever. And you're like, well, and it's probably because something happened in the past, which is you really need to tackle. You've got to deal with that issue first. Because if you have trust issues, you got to deal with them. They're not going to get better. So I think that's different. It's a bit different to jealousy. Jealousy that is based on trust or lack of trust is a whole different because something has happened where the other person didn't know or whatever.

Speaker A: But that's why being in a polyamorous relationship, it's like, you don't have to be jealous because everyone's right there in front of you. It's all very straightforward to the point we understand what everyone likes, who everyone is. Everyone's been tested, no one has any hang up.

Speaker B: Sounds incredible complicated. The size of the house. You need the bed, the car.

Speaker A: But everyone just likes to snuggle, you see.

Speaker B: I'm going to the practical.

Speaker A: Yeah, no, I'm a down for the snuggle.

Speaker B: How do you buy sheets that cover.

Speaker A: A bed, but six professionally made personally, for you and your poly family, I.

Speaker B: Guess you sew three.

Speaker A: You can sew them exactly right. God, I'm sure they make it on Amazon.

Speaker B: They probably do. We should google that. Polyamorous do.

Speaker A: I love that so much.

Speaker B: I mean, it's complex.

Speaker A: Yeah, it's very complex. We'll leave it with that. Hey, Mel, let's do that. Full stop.

Speaker B: Okay?

Speaker A: It's complicated, but you can do it if you want.

Speaker B: Absolutely. No, totally, totally judgment. You do what you want to do, that makes you happy. I'm sure everyone knows.

Speaker A: Exactly.

Speaker B: Consent is key. Consent. Everyone's happy. Everyone wants to be in this. Yes. That's it for me. Full stop on Mel. Full stop.

Speaker A: Fabulous. Okay, well, everyone, thank you so much for joining us today on Sharing My Truth Pod. It's been a fabulous little day.

Speaker B: It has. It's been amazing.

Speaker A: Miss Jamel. You were on vacay.

Speaker B: I was back again.

Speaker A: Well, we'll see you all next week. Thank you so much.

Speaker B: Bye. Thanks so much for listening. Please rate and review this podcast and follow us on social at sharingmytruth pod and leave us a voicemail on our to share your stories and experiences with us. We'll see you next time. Bye.

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